IPS discriminates international users

[boon79]

Hi,

I think most translators encountered the problem with ipb that the administration is only partly translatable. Since version 1 and 2, it has been continuously requested that the adminpanel should also be translatable. For me it was a shock when I found out that v3 is only partly translatable. It looks quite unprofessional when some part of it is translated and other parts remain in english.
It only double shocked me when recently translating the download addon and found out that the phrases of general setting part is again stored in an xml file, and cannot be translated via the language manager. I think we can ask the question, what's the point of having a language manager option. You might as well just drop it all together.

IPS products are great and quickly evolving to be the best if their kind. I think this translation flaw should be priority #1 to solve. All the other forum softwares, including the free ones, are 100% translatable.

English users might say, stop 'Barneys Girlfriend'ing and translate the xml files, but put yourself in the shoes of those who provide translations. Even if you have translated everything you have to say to users that there are some parts that you have to translate for yourself. Oh.... you don't speak english... well there you go... you're screwed.

I know solving this problem is not as easy as adding a new feature, but I hope IPS staff can understand my problem with this and will look into this matter and solve this as soon as possible.

[Mark]

I don't think anyone here disagrees that we would like everything to be language abstracted.
Making those left-hand menus language abstracted is on the to-do list for a near-future release :)

[boon79]

It's good to hear Mark, but unfortunately it's not just the left hand menus.

[Lewis P]

It's good to hear Mark, but unfortunately it's not just the left hand menus.

As far as I was aware the entire ACP apart from the left-hand menus were translatable. Where else is not abstracted?

[boon79]

As far as I was aware the entire ACP apart from the left-hand menus were translatable. Where else is not abstracted?

System Settings for example.
General settings of Download addon. I haven't checked other addons, but I guess it's the same with the gallery and the blog.

[bfarber]

Being able to translate system settings would be very difficult to do. No one is saying we won't do it, but in order to accomplish something like that, basically all database-stored content needs to be translatable, and that's just not feasible.

System settings are only stored in XML files for transport - they're actually pulled from ibf_core_sys_conf_settings table when accessed via the ACP. It's not just settings. Help files, forums, posts, topics, bbcodes, EVERYTHING stored in the database is not translatable - and to do so would be very difficult indeed.

We will continue improving translation, but it's not as easy as just adding language strings I'm afraid.


And to say we discriminate against international users due to technical limitations and the very basic need to balance time vs feasibility for features is going a bit far I'd say. In 2.x you couldn't translate ANY of the ACP. Now you can translate probably 80% of it, and the only things you can't translate aren't stored in skin and source files, which is why it's harder to abstract them. I'd say we made great improvements in 3.x myself.

[Brett B]

I think it's false and, quite frankly, defamatory to say IPS "discriminates" against international users..

[Enkidu]

well, I chose not to translate the ACP part of my board because:

(1) it's not worth the effort as it's not like the ACP is publicly available to everyone on the internet, IPS support and I are the only ones who access it so why ruin it on the support team by converting the ACP language from something that I do understand to something that IPS don't understand?

(2) It's just difficult to find a matching word for a technical term.

but coming to think of it, there are people who don't speak English but then again how are you going to be a good admin if you don't speak English? how do you plan to ask for help? to post questions in technical forums/support?

[boon79]

And to say we discriminate against international users due to technical limitations and the very basic need to balance time vs feasibility for features is going a bit far I'd say.

I didn't say you do/did this to users deliberately. But I guess it's fair to say that you could have thought about this when you were planning the rewrite of the forum before v3.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone who doesn't speak english. The guy buys IPB because he likes it, downloads a translation, but important parts are still not in his language. Quite frustrating

No one is saying we won't do it

So can you say that in a future release it will be 100% translatable?

[DawPi]

but coming to think of it, there are people who don't speak English but then again how are you going to be a good admin if you don't speak English? how do you plan to ask for help? to post questions in technical forums/support?

Some forums has few admins - manager, tech admin, jr admin etc..

[boon79]

well, I chose not to translate the ACP part of my board because:

(1) it's not worth the effort as it's not like the ACP is publicly available to everyone on the internet, IPS support and I are the only ones who access it so why ruin it on the support team by converting the ACP language from something that I do understand to something that IPS don't understand?

if you need help from ips you just change back the default language to english for the time being. No big deal

but coming to think of it, there are people who don't speak English but then again how are you going to be a good admin if you don't speak English? how do you plan to ask for help? to post questions in technical forums/support?

Maybe if you have support in your language?

(2) It's just difficult to find a matching word for a technical term.

i have translated vb and mybb so far, so it's not that difficult.

[Energizer]

I can understand this criticism.
I imagined something else in a complete translation.
It is not OK, that they are trying to down play the whole.

[Enkidu]

if you need help from ips you just change back the default language to english for the time being. No big deal

how the hell would you do that if you don't understand English? and if you do then why translate?

Maybe if you have support in your language?

yes, we do have native support for other forum's software like phpBB but I'd rather ask the devil for help than asking them :lol:

[boon79]

how the hell would you do that if you don't understand English? and if you do then why translate?

if you can't speak english you won't ask help from IPS. Why translate? because i'm a nice guy and provide translation for those who can't speak english.

[media]

The topic title is false....

I am international user and I am damn happy to be here...
Every version they are translating a small part of script (I see this in every version or update)

First time in my programming life I see the dates in my board in my language...
I did not translate the dates it is from server.

IPB made this possible...

I trust IPB management to make IPB 100% translatable if it is possible...
I see result every day...

Keep up the good work guys... :)

Thank you...

[dr. Jekyll]

The topic title is false....

I am international user and I am damn happy to be here...

I agree! I am an international user too and I haven't anything to complain about it.

Honestly I will keep the ACP in English also if was available in Italian. It's more easy to have it in English and follow this community ;)

[Martin A.]

Being able to translate system settings would be very difficult to do. No one is saying we won't do it, but in order to accomplish something like that, basically all database-stored content needs to be translatable, and that's just not feasible.

System settings are only stored in XML files for transport - they're actually pulled from ibf_core_sys_conf_settings table when accessed via the ACP. It's not just settings. Help files, forums, posts, topics, bbcodes, EVERYTHING stored in the database is not translatable - and to do so would be very difficult indeed.

While fetching settings

/**

 * Assuming you tweak that method to load all <app>_admin_* lang files, or make a separate lang file just for system settings,

 * and load data from core_sys_settings_titles no matter what

 */


$this->registry->class_localization->loadLanguageFile( array(), $data['conf_title_app'], 'admin' ); 

// $this->registry->class_localization->loadLanguageFile( array( 'admin_sys_settings' ), $data['conf_title_app'] ); 


/* While parsing settings */

if ( isset( $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] ] ) AND !empty( $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] ] ) )

{

	$r['conf_title'] = $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] ];

}

/* for desc */

if ( isset( $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] . '_desc'] ) AND !empty( $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] . '_desc'] ) )

{

	$r['conf_description'] = $this->lang->words[ $r['conf_key'] . '_desc'];

}

[Brandon D]

Yeah, making the settings titles and descriptions translatable would be extremely easy, but making the setting values themselves translatable would be a bit more involved.

[pisaldi]

well, I chose not to translate the ACP part of my board because:

I have no problem with english and I prefer to have it in english because when I read suggestions here in IPS forums are easier to find...

But, I have some IPB boards and one of them are for spanish spoken IPB support... and several users don,t speak english and would prefer ALL in spanish... we have translated near all the ACP...

:rolleyes: